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Ten Questions Newbie Ask............ |
STEPUP
White Belt
Joined: 17 Mar 2012
Posts: 95
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Post: #16  Posted: Mon May 21, 2012 3:41 pm Post subject: |
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| ajayhkaul wrote: | | STEPUP wrote: | If being on the right side of the market makes profit than its really hard to understand which is the wrong side of the market and can anyone make me understand when any one has taken a risk , how it can be controlled, its all management talk, LIFE is different , If any one hard read "THEORY OF RELATIVITY" or understood a bit knows how to make money out of Equity Market,The fact is everyone is NEWBIE,EVERYONE but the Question here is, what does an individual means about LEARNING, AS A PROCESS OR PROGRESS.
THERE IS NO RIGHT OR WRONG IN MARKET,EVERY PRICE IN EQUITY MARKET AT ANY OCCASION IS TRUE,They difference stands what do you mean by Right or Wrong side of market.
What would have been the WORTH of Equity market if everyone have been making money than its better to have printing press, Prove the Worth, EVERY THING HAS A WORTH,ARE YOU WORTH IT? |
If you are 'long' and market is trending up , then you are on the right side of the market. But if market is trending down , then(since you are long) you are on the wrong side of the market. It is also possible that you were initially on the right side and then a catalyst event turned the market against you.
This applies to 'time frames' that you choose
You may have a favorite trending indicator(s). Understand that indicator well. Icharts has everything you need and more.
And be ready to run whenever the market goes against you (stop loss , based on your risk appetite)
a winner will show up and keep you in it . You don't hold on to any losers
That way even if you have 70% losers(with minimum budgeted losses) and 30% winners that you ride .....you will end up in the green overall.
Losses will be there , minimize them.Be ruthless with losers.
Winners ? see how long your system lets you ride them. Have No regrets if you dont ride all the winners all the way ..c'est la vie (thats life) |
Is it a Regular Discourse of Mr.Ajayhkaul,precisely Pravachan.
No wrong intention ,just query,no hard feeling.  |
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sherbaaz
Yellow Belt
Joined: 27 May 2009
Posts: 543
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| Post: #17 Posted: Mon May 21, 2012 3:51 pm Post subject: |
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read the book by John Piper "The Way to Trade: Discover Your Successful Trading Personality (Harriman Modern Classics)".
the book is divided in 2 parts second part is useless but first part will show you the mirror as a trader and answers many questions.
regds, |
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psalm
Black Belt
Joined: 12 Nov 2011
Posts: 5368
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| Post: #18 Posted: Mon May 21, 2012 4:00 pm Post subject: |
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| ajayhkaul wrote: | | STEPUP wrote: | If being on the right side of the market makes profit than its really hard to understand which is the wrong side of the market and can anyone make me understand when any one has taken a risk , how it can be controlled, its all management talk, LIFE is different , If any one hard read "THEORY OF RELATIVITY" or understood a bit knows how to make money out of Equity Market,The fact is everyone is NEWBIE,EVERYONE but the Question here is, what does an individual means about LEARNING, AS A PROCESS OR PROGRESS.
THERE IS NO RIGHT OR WRONG IN MARKET,EVERY PRICE IN EQUITY MARKET AT ANY OCCASION IS TRUE,They difference stands what do you mean by Right or Wrong side of market.
What would have been the WORTH of Equity market if everyone have been making money than its better to have printing press, Prove the Worth, EVERY THING HAS A WORTH,ARE YOU WORTH IT? |
If you are 'long' and market is trending up , then you are on the right side of the market. But if market is trending down , then(since you are long) you are on the wrong side of the market. It is also possible that you were initially on the right side and then a catalyst event turned the market against you.
This applies to 'time frames' that you choose
You may have a favorite trending indicator(s). Understand that indicator well. Icharts has everything you need and more.
And be ready to run whenever the market goes against you (stop loss , based on your risk appetite)
a winner will show up and keep you in it . You don't hold on to any losers
That way even if you have 70% losers(with minimum budgeted losses) and 30% winners that you ride .....you will end up in the green overall.
Losses will be there , minimize them.Be ruthless with losers.
Winners ? see how long your system lets you ride them. Have No regrets if you dont ride all the winners all the way ..c'est la vie (thats life) |
Very true, Ajay....its always good to go with the trend and then ride them as much as possible (with stoplosses or hedges).....that is one of the best practice to have.....Also, I agree with your opinion that one should be ruthless with losers.....this is very required for a Trader. For an investor, he/could do with holding a losing position. But for a trader, he should never allow the loss to grow. Even holding a stock which is consolidating is not a wise idea....I believe....  |
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SwingTrader
Site Admin
Joined: 11 Aug 2006
Posts: 2903
Location: Hyderabad, India
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| Post: #19 Posted: Mon May 21, 2012 4:24 pm Post subject: |
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Ajay,
Well said.
BTW please read STEPUP's posts again. Does he remind you of someone?  I sense the same tone etc....I think our mathematician friend codered/freedom is back!!! I only hope he is here to offer some useful info this time in his new avataar.
_________________
Srikanth Kurdukar
@SwingTrader |
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STEPUP
White Belt
Joined: 17 Mar 2012
Posts: 95
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| Post: #20 Posted: Mon May 21, 2012 5:56 pm Post subject: |
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| SwingTrader wrote: | Ajay,
Well said.
BTW please read STEPUP's posts again. Does he remind you of someone? I sense the same tone etc....I think our mathematician friend codered/freedom is back!!! I only hope he is here to offer some useful info this time in his new avataar.
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Well Said ST.
Do you need to have KUA to understand who am i?
Regarding Avatar, Sense & Tone ?
Let me than sing a song for you?
ST PRAVACHAN will not work than have Laundry Service at least it will clean something.
The best thing about Icharts.in , it has ST as its Administrator. 
Last edited by STEPUP on Mon May 21, 2012 6:05 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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gauravmutha
White Belt
Joined: 02 Mar 2012
Posts: 12
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| Post: #21 Posted: Mon May 21, 2012 6:04 pm Post subject: |
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1. Nothing can be called as best because every indicator has its own importance. people have different strategies to trading so they use indicator to suit their styles of trading.
MY opinion in trending market MACD works best and in trading market stochastic.
2.SWing trading is much better as it is difficult to master the art of intraday trading. Intrady market hv many whispaws.
3. Index futures r best to trade
4.Firstly u need to read some standard books on technical analysis then u will find all these your answers.You can start your trading with just rs 10000 |
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hasten
White Belt
Joined: 30 Jun 2011
Posts: 216
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| Post: #22 Posted: Mon May 21, 2012 6:39 pm Post subject: Re: Ten Questions Newbie Ask............ |
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| amitsaraf21 wrote: |
3. What is better index futures or individual stock futures.
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As Stated above, Futures are derivatives where two parties agree to transact a set of financial instruments or physical commodities for future delivery at a particular price. Index futures are futures contracts where the underlying is a stock index (Nifty or Sensex) and helps a trader to take a view on the market as a whole.
Single stock futures (also known as SSF) are futures markets that are based upon an individual stock (such as RIL for Reliance), rather than an entire stock index (such as the Nifty Sensex). Single stock futures are exactly the same as any other futures markets, and are traded in exactly the same way.
Regards, hasten
Good things come to those who wait, but the best things come to those who work for it. |
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amitsaraf21
White Belt
Joined: 20 Feb 2009
Posts: 76
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| Post: #23 Posted: Mon May 21, 2012 7:44 pm Post subject: Re: Ten Questions Newbie Ask............ |
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Individual stock futures are in general more volatile than Index futures.
Higher volatility may give you a chance to make more money when things move your way but that comes with additional risk associated with volatility.
| hasten wrote: | | amitsaraf21 wrote: |
3. What is better index futures or individual stock futures.
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As Stated above, Futures are derivatives where two parties agree to transact a set of financial instruments or physical commodities for future delivery at a particular price. Index futures are futures contracts where the underlying is a stock index (Nifty or Sensex) and helps a trader to take a view on the market as a whole.
Single stock futures (also known as SSF) are futures markets that are based upon an individual stock (such as RIL for Reliance), rather than an entire stock index (such as the Nifty Sensex). Single stock futures are exactly the same as any other futures markets, and are traded in exactly the same way.
Regards, hasten
Good things come to those who wait, but the best things come to those who work for it. |
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hasten
White Belt
Joined: 30 Jun 2011
Posts: 216
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| Post: #24 Posted: Mon May 21, 2012 8:03 pm Post subject: Re: Ten Questions Newbie Ask............ |
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| amitsaraf21 wrote: | Individual stock futures are in general more volatile than Index futures.
Higher volatility may give you a chance to make more money when things move your way but that comes with additional risk associated with volatility.
| hasten wrote: | | amitsaraf21 wrote: |
3. What is better index futures or individual stock futures.
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As Stated above, Futures are derivatives where two parties agree to transact a set of financial instruments or physical commodities for future delivery at a particular price. Index futures are futures contracts where the underlying is a stock index (Nifty or Sensex) and helps a trader to take a view on the market as a whole.
Single stock futures (also known as SSF) are futures markets that are based upon an individual stock (such as RIL for Reliance), rather than an entire stock index (such as the Nifty Sensex). Single stock futures are exactly the same as any other futures markets, and are traded in exactly the same way.
Regards, hasten
Good things come to those who wait, but the best things come to those who work for it. |
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Sorry but comparing stock and index based on volatility is not the right ,If u want high volatility trade mid-caps and for higher volatility you can choose small-caps too .(there are few stocks available which trade on less volatility then index.)
Regards, hasten
I strive to put in perfect trades again and again, every time, always.
Last edited by hasten on Mon May 21, 2012 8:12 pm; edited 2 times in total |
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ajayhkaul
Yellow Belt
Joined: 18 Jun 2009
Posts: 866
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| Post: #25 Posted: Mon May 21, 2012 8:08 pm Post subject: |
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Ahhh....ST , I had forgotten about this fella....some people just don't give up , do they? Hope he keeps 'evolving' in his new avatar.
Congrats Psalm on your black belt status ... you deserve it and keep those posts coming.
Since STEPUP seems to like pravachans , here's more !
This time from a professional trader:
''....I personally have belonged to each of these categories at one time or another.
1 - The Logician - Believes that every trade can be won and spends hours breaking down each losing bet looking for the "mistake" that would have turned a loser into a winner.
2 - The Action Junkie - Takes every possible trade regardless of the chances of winning.
3- The Dreamer - Always looking for the big score by making trades with little chance of winning. These people usually had some success with a "system" and are waiting for lightening to strike twice. Winning once or twice with that system is the worst thing that could have happened to them.
4- The Eternal Student - How many books do you have on trading. How many "systems" have you tried. I've got a book-shelf filled with literally hundreds of books on trading. These days, all they do is gather dust!
5 - The Creative Type - Have you ever tried a system that was almost profitable? Then the next day you tried another system that was almost profitable. Then the third day you decided to create you own system by combining both of these systems and (you guessed it) it was still "almost" profitable.
6***.. Lost types...lost in a maze of information , indicators , conflicting views etc Lost money too...
These guys get cynical and think someone is pulled a fast one on them since they are looking for precision/guaranteed results. Alas,Trading is not precise since future cannot be predicted , only a probable view is possible.
If you fall into one of these categories, don't let it bother you. Virtually all successful traders go through the same thing.
"Perfection is achieved, not when there is nothing more to add, but when there is nothing left to take away." - Antoine de Saint-Exupery French writer (1900 - 1944)
In both horse racing and trading, when you peel away all of the mis-information, there is one basic truth that determines if you will be a winner or a loser. When you understand and apply these truths, you can't help but be a winner.
In trading, there is one simple thing you must do to be a winner. You must be on the right side of the market....."
*** I added that one ! |
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vinay28
Black Belt
Joined: 24 Dec 2010
Posts: 11748
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| Post: #26 Posted: Mon May 21, 2012 8:20 pm Post subject: |
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| ST, and you thought life couldn't be better. Looks like it's in your fate to be on your toes. Keep hunting! |
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chrome
Yellow Belt
Joined: 28 Dec 2009
Posts: 645
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| Post: #27 Posted: Mon May 21, 2012 10:05 pm Post subject: |
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hi frnz..logged on yo icharts after a very long time..nd found an interesting topic immediately..
well..as per my little knowledge...backtest all time frames as per ur chosen one indicator....check on various stocks nd indices...check where it worked fine nd where not...
where not is the timeframe u need to check...why not?? check secondary indicators u hv decided....make a combo of say 3 indicators....check the combined ratio of all three on backtesting charts...it will definately help..but these all indicators have to be picked continuosly..dont change them everyday....which one?? that need to be spoted on individualy...i know its easier saying than doing...... BUT ONLY TOUGH ONE WINS HERE.......NOT MASSES.....hope m able to tell here what i do as per my little knowledge...
rgds |
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ProTrader
Site Admin
Joined: 06 Jul 2008
Posts: 433
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| Post: #28 Posted: Tue May 22, 2012 1:16 am Post subject: |
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We did many TA sessions across India (ok now don't ask us what happened to deep diving) and found a common theme..majority of the people wanted to know only two thing:
1. When to buy
2. When to sell
and often ST and I will be looking at each other. After 8 hours, a Breakfast, Lunch and Snacks..those were the 2 often repeated questions. Though they were answered in multiple ways in multiple strategies throughout the day.
May be it is the language, that is complex or focus of the mind..or something else..but as I said, we need to keep repeating the message, keep awakening the minds..through pravachans or laundry..whatever works. 
BestR....PT |
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ajayhkaul
Yellow Belt
Joined: 18 Jun 2009
Posts: 866
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| Post: #29 Posted: Tue May 22, 2012 1:45 am Post subject: |
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| ProTrader wrote: | We did many TA sessions across India (ok now don't ask us what happened to deep diving) and found a common theme..majority of the people wanted to know only two thing:
1. When to buy
2. When to sell
and often ST and I will be looking at each other. After 8 hours, a Breakfast, Lunch and Snacks..those were the 2 often repeated questions. Though they were answered in multiple ways in multiple strategies throughout the day.
May be it is the language, that is complex or focus of the mind..or something else..but as I said, we need to keep repeating the message, keep awakening the minds..through pravachans or laundry..whatever works.
BestR....PT |
My experience has been that people hear about someone who minted money and form a bias that trading is 'simple'( aka easy money) and then, as things get 'complicated' with indicators and charts,they expect a 'sure shot' system like the one that made money for the person they heard about ! They wonder why the coach is complicating things!
So they get pulled in by 'stories' and pushed out by systems that work around UNCERTAINTIES.
Too much to handle for most mortals....no wonder only 5% or so make it.
If only people would understand that no business succeeds without failure(s) , they would realize that losses are a part of the process of eventual gains..... |
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STEPUP
White Belt
Joined: 17 Mar 2012
Posts: 95
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| Post: #30 Posted: Tue May 22, 2012 7:33 am Post subject: |
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| ajayhkaul wrote: | Ahhh....ST , I had forgotten about this fella....some people just don't give up , do they? Hope he keeps 'evolving' in his new avatar.
Congrats Psalm on your black belt status ... you deserve it and keep those posts coming.
Since STEPUP seems to like pravachans , here's more !
This time from a professional trader:
''....I personally have belonged to each of these categories at one time or another.
1 - The Logician - Believes that every trade can be won and spends hours breaking down each losing bet looking for the "mistake" that would have turned a loser into a winner.
2 - The Action Junkie - Takes every possible trade regardless of the chances of winning.
3- The Dreamer - Always looking for the big score by making trades with little chance of winning. These people usually had some success with a "system" and are waiting for lightening to strike twice. Winning once or twice with that system is the worst thing that could have happened to them.
4- The Eternal Student - How many books do you have on trading. How many "systems" have you tried. I've got a book-shelf filled with literally hundreds of books on trading. These days, all they do is gather dust!
5 - The Creative Type - Have you ever tried a system that was almost profitable? Then the next day you tried another system that was almost profitable. Then the third day you decided to create you own system by combining both of these systems and (you guessed it) it was still "almost" profitable.
6***.. Lost types...lost in a maze of information , indicators , conflicting views etc Lost money too...
These guys get cynical and think someone is pulled a fast one on them since they are looking for precision/guaranteed results. Alas,Trading is not precise since future cannot be predicted , only a probable view is possible.
If you fall into one of these categories, don't let it bother you. Virtually all successful traders go through the same thing.
"Perfection is achieved, not when there is nothing more to add, but when there is nothing left to take away." - Antoine de Saint-Exupery French writer (1900 - 1944)
In both horse racing and trading, when you peel away all of the mis-information, there is one basic truth that determines if you will be a winner or a loser. When you understand and apply these truths, you can't help but be a winner.
In trading, there is one simple thing you must do to be a winner. You must be on the right side of the market....."
*** I added that one ! |
Yes Ajayhkaul, you rightly said, some people never give up, like me as a wannabe, like you being the master in Pravachan & like ST as its Administrators,Have the guts to face Truth rather giving out Pravachans, I do understand Birds of Same Feather always Flock together.
I hope you have heard the proverb "Mullah ki daud Masjid tak", so what is my limit, i know at best being Banned but for You & ST, you can enlighten me.
As you write all along article with admiring & sincere Copy & Paste Skill, but you forget in between "ITS ALL ABOUT PERCEPTION". |
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